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tinker
07-10-2012, 14:13
I've tried to look of past threads but

for those of you guys who's mastered or almost learnt spanish , how and what methods did you use.

I'm currently using rosetta stone, some other websites, and wanting to download an audio book for when I'm at work.

we tried lessons but our local teacher was a bit strange (ok very strange our neighbours even asked us to stop using him!!! ??????)

i really want to put lots of effort into this and jus wondering what you found helped?

Malteser Monkey
07-10-2012, 14:25
A Spanish/Canarian boyfriend/girlfriend ...............best way.:cheeky:

Then I went to a School which really helped. I'm no way near fluent (still learning English :lol:) but I know enough to get by and understand what's being talked about.

Whatever you do stick with it - you'll get there in the end. Also once you've learned the basics log on to Spanish TV and radio and just listen and see if you can recognise anything

Suerte Chica !

chifleta
07-10-2012, 14:37
I have to agree with the Canarian boyfriend, but for it to work properly it has to be more than a one-night stand :crylaughing:

I lived in Garachico for a year, so didn't have much choice, plus I watched lots of telly, so learnt a lot that way.

They say Rosetta Stone is a good way to learn, you just have to read out loud as much as you can to get the speed up as well... and once you live here, don't live in typically Brit areas, try living in villages where they are mainly locals..

Also like Monkey says, listen to tv programmes, I watch this one most mornings:

http://www.youtube.com/user/InformativosTvc?feature=CAQQwRs%3D

you can hear different accents after a while... Roberto the usual main newsreader speaks nicely I think.

tinker
07-10-2012, 14:44
yeah that was my next step in a few months to download some tv programmes :)

Malteser Monkey
07-10-2012, 14:55
I have to agree with the Canarian boyfriend, but for it to work properly it has to be more than a one-night stand :crylaughing:

Oi they were:crylaughing:

Santiago
07-10-2012, 15:40
Oi they were:crylaughing:

They? Plural? :eyebrows:

Malteser Monkey
07-10-2012, 16:03
They? Plural? :eyebrows:

just to make sure:laugh:

Santiago
07-10-2012, 16:13
just to make sure:laugh:

And, of course, to learn all the regional variations like Catalan, Galician, Canarian, etc. :respect:

chifleta
07-10-2012, 17:31
They? Plural? :eyebrows:

she dropped herself right in it there :crylaughing::crylaughing::crylaughing:

Suzanne
07-10-2012, 17:50
having kids makes you learn sooner rather than later!!!!!
You can look at this website, 123teachme.com
Stick with it you will get there.

Medanoman
07-10-2012, 19:52
Learning any language requires lots of motivation and exposure. I never went to school to learn Spanish. I picked it up living in La Coruna in my twenties when i transferred my unemployment benefit there. I ended up with a Galician Girlfriend. But work was hard to come by back ( When isn't it not) then and I ended hitching a lift home on a 50ft Spanish registered fishing boat as a deck hand to Milford Haven..

I met my other half in Portsmouth in the uk. She arrived in the UK from Tenerife, speaking basic English. Her English is perhaps the best English of any Spanish person i have ever met here. Why? Cause she worked on the night shift at the Este lauder production line in Petersfield for 4 years. She had a very hard time in the beginning. And moving in with me didn't help i suppose. Since she was learning English at work I decided it was better for me to perfect my Spanish at home and only ever spoke Spanish to her in the UK. All in preparation for the move out here.

I am now fluent in Spanish but that's due to almost 25 years exposure to it in one way or another. Unfortunately many Spanish people i know read and write English well but are unable to string 2 words together. Speaking is far more important than grammar. Don't be afraid to make mistakes speaking, its the only way you really learn. Confusing Polla with pollo is only done once in Spanish lol...

Malteser Monkey
07-10-2012, 19:55
And, of course, to learn all the regional variations like Catalan, Galician, Canarian, etc. :respect:


she dropped herself right in it there :crylaughing::crylaughing::crylaughing:

Noo nooo noo just the local North and South oh and Gomera now we are talking different accents :spin:

poker
07-10-2012, 20:06
Having spanish neibours who like red wine and fiestas :beer::beer::beer: .

Sent from my GT-P1000 using Tapatalk 2

chifleta
07-10-2012, 20:29
Learning any language requires lots of motivation and exposure. I never went to school to learn Spanish. I picked it up living in La Coruna in my twenties when i transferred my unemployment benefit there. I ended up with a Galician Girlfriend. But work was hard to come by back ( When isn't it not) then and I ended hitching a lift home on a 50ft Spanish registered fishing boat as a deck hand to Milford Haven..

I met my other half in Portsmouth in the uk. She arrived in the UK from Tenerife, speaking basic English. Her English is perhaps the best English of any Spanish person i have ever met here. Why? Cause she worked on the night shift at the Este lauder production line in Petersfield for 4 years. She had a very hard time in the beginning. And moving in with me didn't help i suppose. Since she was learning English at work I decided it was better for me to perfect my Spanish at home and only ever spoke Spanish to her in the UK. All in preparation for the move out here.

I am now fluent in Spanish but that's due to almost 25 years exposure to it in one way or another. Unfortunately many Spanish people i know read and write English well but are unable to string 2 words together. Speaking is far more important than grammar. Don't be afraid to make mistakes speaking, its the only way you really learn. Confusing Polla with pollo is only done once in Spanish lol...

as is confusing cajones with..... LOL I always remember a friend in the local bar with my OH bragging about sanding his chest of drawers, except he said the wrong word LOL

I'd say i'm fluent in Spanish, albeit it gramatically incorrect a lot of times... OH (who is Canarian) also says my main mistake is using too many words, he says "why use 5 words when 2 will do" :-D

warbey
07-10-2012, 20:33
I used to Holiday in Catalonia where only Spanish was spoken usually.

A year of Night School in the U.k. to help it along.

I know some now as a Result, but Grammatically is a different matter.

Whatever You do, regular practice is a Must.!

Kiki
09-10-2012, 16:34
I have been learning at la Escuela Oficial de Idiomas (language school) in Los Cristianos, i´m in my third year now. It is a brilliant course, alot of hard work involving the grammar but it really pays of in the end!

chifleta
09-10-2012, 17:12
I tried to get onto that course the other year, but I ended up 26th on the "runners up" waiting list ... i'd say i'm fairly fluent in Spanish, good Canarian accent too LOL but my grammar!, well we won't go into that LOL

Harmonicaman
09-10-2012, 17:22
I just add "o" or "a" to the end of English words if it's a bloke or a chick...seems to work.

Kiki
09-10-2012, 17:27
I tried to get onto that course the other year, but I ended up 26th on the "runners up" waiting list ... i'd say i'm fairly fluent in Spanish, good Canarian accent too LOL but my grammar!, well we won't go into that LOL

I know as its such a popular course and limited spaces its unfortunate some people don't get in. I always sign up on the very first day of registration in april so my place is guarenteed to start in september.

chifleta
09-10-2012, 17:30
I know as its such a popular course and limited spaces its unfortunate some people don't get in. I always sign up on the very first day of registration in april so my place is guarenteed to start in september.

I would have also needed to do a pre-entry exam to see how good/bad my Spanish really is :) oh well, i'm in no rush - beed here 20 years and haven't starved to death yet ...

cainaries
09-10-2012, 18:46
I started by going to the Don Quijote Institute in London. It was very hard going because most of the rest of the class had just left university and were used to studying and I hadn't studied anything for about 30 years! I'm afraid I gave up on it, four hours every Saturday morning and I was working flat out all week. Then I went to night school just down the road from where we lived and met a really excellent group of enthusiastic fellow students and a good teacher and passed GCSE Spanish with A* only to move out here and find I couldn't understand a word anyone said. Went to Spanish-for-idiot-foreigners courses for a few years here on La Palma but they weren't hugely useful, tbh, just writing loads of grammar down which wasn't very motivating. Now I just go to Spanish conversation classes. The grammar is just too hard.

I've noticed several new language schools (well 3!) have opened up on La Palma this year. One course charges €75 a month for 2x2 hours a week. But they won't let you sit in on a class to see if it is for you and I'm not going to risk €75 only to find it's just four hours of writing down grammar rules.

warbey
09-10-2012, 19:41
Are there any Canarians who want to Learn English, and prepared to help Your Spanish.

Something to do after Dinner.......lol...

Javi
10-10-2012, 17:50
As Spanish-Canarian resident it surprise me how many British people want to learn Spanish :bowdown:.

I have been learning English for several years now and never put a foot in a school. Just listening, watching and reading in English at any time my children allow me to do it. Nevertheless, I feel I need to improve my speech and pronunciation.

I am willing to do a languajes exchange (English for Spanish). Those who are interested, please send me a PM.

Regards,

Javi.

tinker
11-10-2012, 08:39
As Spanish-Canarian resident it surprise me how many British people want to learn Spanish :bowdown:.

I have been learning English for several years now and never put a foot in a school. Just listening, watching and reading in English at any time my children allow me to do it. Nevertheless, I feel I need to improve my speech and pronunciation.

I am willing to do a languajes exchange (English for Spanish). Those who are interested, please send me a PM.

Regards,

Javi.

thats a fantastic opportunity for someone on the island!!!

:):):)

9PLUS
11-10-2012, 09:50
How to Learn Spanish = Pay attention


Cheers

xx

euroteide
11-10-2012, 10:43
I suggest people to go to the Escuela Oficial de Idiomas as it is very cheap for a yearly course and you get an official Spanish certificate.

9PLUS
11-10-2012, 18:18
I suggest people to go to the Escuela Oficial de Idiomas as it is very cheap for a yearly course and you get an official Spanish certificate.


Red Cross · Cruz Roja - learn Spanish for free

la vera
12-10-2012, 23:26
I learnt some spanish while being 5 months in Barcelona for the university erasmus programm, but 5 months were, of course, not enough. After that I just continued studying on my own, reading loads of latin-american literature in spanish: by Gabriel García Markéz, Isabel Allende etc. And later, when I went to UK to improve my english, I met so many spanish friends with very basic english, that there was no other way to communicate than in spanish... So, I improved it as well... I love this language!

Well, it might be to hard for you to read books, however, to meet new friends among the local people should not be so difficult. Have a small chat in the supermarket or on the street, and don't be afraid of making mistakes. I think, it is more efficient and pleasant way to learn spanish than cramming empty words at school or home.

YOUNG GOLFER
13-10-2012, 00:13
Just picked it up over the years.......I spend a lot of my free time with the locals.......and anyone thinking of learning fast then you should do the same....they are great people.

deepdivejunkie
13-10-2012, 19:02
Had lessons for a couple of months when I first came here to get the basics. Then picked the rest up by frequenting Spanish bars and working with the Spanish. Forget about English bars if you want to learn. Im not literally perfect but I'm understood and understand.
Best way is not to translate to yourself, but to try and think in Spanish.

chifleta
13-10-2012, 20:57
Best way is not to translate to yourself, but to try and think in Spanish.

Totally agree..... I apparently talk in my sleep in Spanish LOL

Anyway, some translations are just no possible - the "I dump in the milk" always makes me laugh when someone asks what I said :-D

Angusjim
14-10-2012, 07:55
Just picked it up over the years.......I spend a lot of my free time with the locals.......and anyone thinking of learning fast then you should do the same....they are great people.

YG how about learning and puting into practise the Spanish for " no no its my round I have not bought a drink all night":laugh:

funhunter
15-11-2012, 00:29
The best way is to get yourself an initial course with student book, cd and workbook and work your way through it systematically to gather vocabulary and basic grammar. As soon as you can string a few words together practise, practise and practise in the shops, bars or wherever and soon the language will build up until you're fluent. At any level you can watch films with Spanish subtitles and later viceversa, read newspapers and listen to the radio/TV. Even if you don't understand it you will subconsciously acquire the right intonation and rhythm necessary to speak properly and then bit by bit things will start to fit together. Once you get that far it's like entering a new world as you can connect with the country you're living in. Good luck!

anegib
15-11-2012, 11:15
I learned Spanish by living in an area where no one speaks English at all. It really does help and the Tenerife people have been very good helping me.

languagefan
15-11-2012, 12:18
1) "Spanish demystified" is a fantastic start, very easy read, and by the time you reach the end of the book you have learned a good deal of vocab and grammar.
2) disconnecting satellite TV and watching Spanish TV with subtitles is a great strategy.
3) A copy of "verbos espanoles conjugados" is a must buy, and you need to practice conjugation of a few verbs using it everyday.
4) Finally do not be shy, make friends with Spanish friends and be open to make mistakes and they will correct you.
Good luck

KirstyJay
15-11-2012, 13:06
Working in Spanish state school for 6 years did it for me :)

Javi
15-11-2012, 18:06
Funhunter and Languagefan...I couldn't more agree. I did and I am still doing that to learn English. As many other skills, you must practise everyday, no matter how much, but everyday (read, listen, watch, write, chat, email...).

Thanks to this forum I've meet people who not only want to learn Spanish but also want to help me with my English. :)

Picture
22-11-2012, 09:02
Hello tinker,

If you really want to learn spanish, you need a teacher. Websites and (audio)books are a good idea, but they don't answer your questions, and, of course, they don't talk with you. You should find a new teacher, now you can find one even in internet (like espanolonlineblog.wordpress.com). Good luck!

Javi
23-11-2012, 23:34
I disagree Picture. Although I have to admit that a teacher is one of the way to learn English, it is not the cheapest option, it is not easy to find a good teacher and finally, even though you get the right teacher, he/she is not always going to be a warranty that the best results are achieved.

A language buddy is by far much productive, helpful, effective and amusing. They can also answer your questions.

My experiences (and the other ones) have shown to me that the best results are obtained by combining two essential factors: a book (CD or online resources) that gives you the basic foundations and daily practices. Keep practising (chat, reading, listening...) even in hell.

But bear in mind that as in every learning process you should have a defined objective which helps you keeping focused.

Saj
06-12-2012, 16:36
I'm doing a language exchange which is working for me. I'll check out some of the link here, thanks!!

Javi
13-12-2012, 22:40
A language exchange is working for me too. More confident, less grammar mistakes and better pronunciation.

Javi
15-01-2013, 22:19
Just two questions.

What are the most challenging aspects for British people when learning Spanish?
How many times did you try to go for it and how many did you give up? Why?


Look forward to reading honest and sensible answers.

cainaries
15-01-2013, 23:46
Just two questions.

What are the most challenging aspects for British people when learning Spanish?
How many times did you try to go for it and how many did you give up? Why?


Look forward to reading honest and sensible answers.

I could write you a long list. Please please don't be offended!! I have never actually given up the whole idea but I have certainly modified my approach to learning Spanish. Here are just a few examples:

1, The fact that Spanish has two verbs for 'to be'. When learning any language this is the first verb you learn and to discover it comes in two forms is very off-putting right at the start.

2. Spanish irregular verbs. (Yes I know English consists of very complicated verbs as well, all those 'phrasal' verbs .. is that the right word, to get up, to get out, to get off, to get on, to get on with, to get on without ... yes, I see that this is complicated ...)

3. The words which look the same as English but actually aren't.....constipado is one of several examples ... !

I could go on but I won't. And how do you say that in Spanish?

Buenas noches.

Megaloo
16-01-2013, 00:01
I could write you a long list. Please please don't be offended!! I have never actually given up the whole idea but I have certainly modified my approach to learning Spanish. Here are just a few examples:

1, The fact that Spanish has two verbs for 'to be'. When learning any language this is the first verb you learn and to discover it comes in two forms is very off-putting right at the start.

2. Spanish irregular verbs. (Yes I know English consists of very complicated verbs as well, all those 'phrasal' verbs .. is that the right word, to get up, to get out, to get off, to get on, to get on with, to get on without ... yes, I see that this is complicated ...)

3. The words which look the same as English but actually aren't.....constipado is one of several examples ... !

I could go on but I won't. And how do you say that in Spanish?

Buenas noches.

Well put Canaries I really have a job to get my head around it and for it to stay in there?? But I also think trying to learn (as far as I am concerned) as an older lady is much more difficult goes in one ear and out the other

nelson
16-01-2013, 08:28
Well put Canaries I really have a job to get my head around it and for it to stay in there?? But I also think trying to learn (as far as I am concerned) as an older lady is much more difficult goes in one ear and out the other

If you can self learn the baby style instant Spanish is a good start, it gives you instant Spanish with only 400 words. It's very basic but it can build a bit of confidence and you have to start somewhere .

After that the Michel Thomas 8 hour course is amazing. In reality you will go over each of the 1 hour discs you will play over and over and your learning will improve each time. The learning method is fantastic, he gets you speaking sentances and the past tences etc.

After that just build word knowledge,there's a teach yourself book with chapters on just words, so once you have sentances you need word knowledge for things.

So I would say start with the basics , the do Michel Thomas then just keep expanding word knowledge.

I tried other self learn books after the baby basic instant one, I think they did help me but the Michel Thomas one was the big step forward for my Spanish.

Javi
16-01-2013, 09:28
I could write you a long list. Please please don't be offended!! I have never actually given up the whole idea but I have certainly modified my approach to learning Spanish. Here are just a few examples:

1, The fact that Spanish has two verbs for 'to be'. When learning any language this is the first verb you learn and to discover it comes in two forms is very off-putting right at the start.

2. Spanish irregular verbs. (Yes I know English consists of very complicated verbs as well, all those 'phrasal' verbs .. is that the right word, to get up, to get out, to get off, to get on, to get on with, to get on without ... yes, I see that this is complicated ...)

3. The words which look the same as English but actually aren't.....constipado is one of several examples ... !

I could go on but I won't. And how do you say that in Spanish?

Buenas noches.

A very good post...I am not offended.

Yes, I already knew that the approach to "to be" - ser o estar - is one of the first challenges for the students of Spanish, doesn't matter their nationality.

Just a basic rule: "Ser" is used when we are talking about the essence of somebody or something. The essence is a feature that is always with you (or with the thing). i.e. The apple is green, it's mean its colour is green.
On teh other hand, "estar" is used to talk about a condition. p.e. Yo estoy casado (I am married) or La manzana está verde (the apple is green), it's mean that the apple it's not ripe.

I think the big problem in our appoach to other languages is that as adult we try to learn very focused on grammar. It's bay far better start working in listening skills, like a child. My children of 4 and 16 months can speak Spanish and they know nothing about grammar and they can't write a thing either.


I could go on but I won't = Podría continuar (o seguir) pero no lo haré.

So the best way to start in listening sentences in real/daily contexts. 80% listening and conversation skills and 20% grammar it would be a good balance.

One day I'll speak about my frustrations when learning English...26 letter in your alphabet and 44 different sounds...it's crazy!:confused:

Malteser Monkey
16-01-2013, 11:32
A very good post...I am not offended.

Yes, I already knew that the approach to "to be" - ser o estar - is one of the first challenges for the students of Spanish, doesn't matter their nationality.

Just a basic rule: "Ser" is used when we are talking about the essence of somebody or something. The essence is a feature that is always with you (or with the thing). i.e. The apple is green, it's mean its colour is green.
On teh other hand, "estar" is used to talk about a condition. p.e. Yo estoy casado (I am married) or La manzana está verde (the apple is green), it's mean that the apple it's not ripe.

I think the big problem in our appoach to other languages is that as adult we try to learn very focused on grammar. It's bay far better start working in listening skills, like a child. My children of 4 and 16 months can speak Spanish and they know nothing about grammar and they can't write a thing either.


I could go on but I won't = Podría continuar (o seguir) pero no lo haré.

So the best way to start in listening sentences in real/daily contexts. 80% listening and conversation skills and 20% grammar it would be a good balance.

One day I'll speak about my frustrations when learning English...26 letter in your alphabet and 44 different sounds...it's crazy!:confused:

Javi take a look at the Welsh language - you'll be glad you learnt English !

Ysbyty - try saying that it means hospital !

Uzbitty is how it's pronounced

I don't speak Welsh can understand bit and words that's about it. Still struggling with English :whistle:

y el Español

nice to have you around to help Javi !

ribuck
16-01-2013, 12:54
The fact that Spanish has two verbs for 'to be'.

This little rhyme solved it completely for me:

"How you feel and where you are,
That is when you use estar,
What you're like and where you're from
Is when you use the other one!"

On the other hand, por and para still mixes me up sometimes...

nelson
16-01-2013, 13:04
the ser and estar I think, adds to the language, we dont have it in english but I can see the point of it. same applies to the tu or usted for you, it creates a bit more to the spanish language. With that one though, you never know if you should use the tu or are you being rude.

the whole principle of male or female words is also very alien to english speakers. Makes sense with boy or girl , but what makes a table a la mesa ? Not that that makes learning any more difficult , and gender mistakes are to be expected of english speakers , michel thomas says you will still be understood.

Javi is quite right about the different sounds of english letters in different words, how complicated is that, spanish vowels are all always the same soundings.

ribuck
16-01-2013, 13:32
"How you feel and where you are,
That is when you use estar,
What you're like and where you're from
Is when you use the other one!"
I was asked for an example.

Suppose you are bored. From the rhyme, this is "how you feel", so you use estar like this:

"Estoy aburrido" ("I am bored").

Suppose you are boring. From the rhyme, this is "what you're like", so you use ser like this:

"Soy aburrido" ("I am boring").

Anniehelling20
16-01-2013, 14:06
Hi! The best way is to learn Spanish is with a native Spanish speaker and if possible, have one to one lessons as you will learn much quicker than in a class with a group of 10/15 students. I have been learning Spanish for 3 months with Your Spanish Online (www.yourspanishonline.com). My tutor is a qualified native Spanish teacher and she is great! She helps me with my pronunciation and vocabulary and she always find the easiest way to learn the grammar! If you want to learn Spanish I would highly recommend this company!

cainaries
16-01-2013, 16:44
Well put Canaries I really have a job to get my head around it and for it to stay in there?? But I also think trying to learn (as far as I am concerned) as an older lady is much more difficult goes in one ear and out the other

I'm not sure it even goes in one ear sometimes! It is certainly harder the older one gets. I think this has been scientifically proven though I'm sure there are exceptions.

warbey
16-01-2013, 20:28
There are those of us who have not given up. I cannot. I like to talk to People.

I have two weeks each Year to Learn and 50 weeks to forget it all again.


I had five Years of French at secondary School. Most long forgotten, but I remember

well the masculine and feminine so I have been helped by this knowledge in advance, I suppose.

I agree Cainaries. Older = Harder.


To learn more, I would live in a Spanish Community with no English, (or very little) spoken.
Two Years minimum would help, I am Sure.. I would love to do this. Not too sure O.H. would though.!

Javi
17-01-2013, 09:41
Javi take a look at the Welsh language - you'll be glad you learnt English !

Ysbyty - try saying that it means hospital !

Uzbitty is how it's pronounced

I don't speak Welsh can understand bit and words that's about it. Still struggling with English :whistle:

y el Español

nice to have you around to help Javi !

I didn't know that Wales had its own language...;)

It could be even worse. Just try to start with arabian, chinese or maltese. I spent 3 weeks in Malta and I couldn't pick up a word...and hey! I am still young :D

- - - - - - - - - - merged double post - - - - - - - - - -


There are those of us who have not given up. I cannot. I like to talk to People.

I have two weeks each Year to Learn and 50 weeks to forget it all again.


I had five Years of French at secondary School. Most long forgotten, but I remember

well the masculine and feminine so I have been helped by this knowledge in advance, I suppose.

I agree Cainaries. Older = Harder.


To learn more, I would live in a Spanish Community with no English, (or very little) spoken.
Two Years minimum would help, I am Sure.. I would love to do this. Not too sure O.H. would though.!

No excuses warbey and caineries...older people are very capable to learn new things as a new language. Ok. If you want to rewrite "El Quijote" perhaps it's a bit late but it's never late to learn some basic skills which allows you to have and keep up a conversation about any daily topic.

The fact that many of you are living abroad (from Spain) doesn't mean that you can't learn Spanish because there're a lot of excellent resources out there (someone's mentioned Michel Thomas on this thread), CD, free online courses, online TV and radio stations, language buddies, etc.

The assertion: you'll learn faster if you were living in Spain, isn't always true.

Keep posting

Megaloo
17-01-2013, 10:10
That is very true Javi "Learn fast living in Spain" here I am still struggling.

Malteser Monkey
17-01-2013, 10:15
I didn't know that Wales had its own language...;)

.and hey! I am still young :D

Ok Javi - am going off you - what you trying to say....I'm old ?:twak::D:D

Javi
17-01-2013, 14:08
Ok Javi - am going off you - what you trying to say....I'm old ?:twak::D:D

No, no, no!:sorry: I just wanted to say I am still young - OK, I am 37 -...learning new things doesn't depend on how old you are

Fivepence
17-01-2013, 14:12
No, no, no!:sorry: I just wanted to say I am still young - OK, I am 37 -...learning new things doesn't depend on how old you are

I can remember being 37, it seems like yesterday. :whistle:

chifleta
17-01-2013, 14:28
I can remember being 37, it seems like yesterday. :whistle:

We must sound/chat/type like we're ancient hahahahaha

Megaloo
17-01-2013, 15:13
We must sound/chat/type like we're ancient hahahahaha

I am :crying2:

chifleta
17-01-2013, 15:29
I am :crying2:

:console::console: blessssssssssssss

Fivepence
17-01-2013, 16:25
I am :crying2:

I'm Spartacus............:laugh:

warbey
17-01-2013, 19:53
I am not saying anything at all at all at all.....

Javi
17-01-2013, 23:09
That is very true Javi "Learn fast living in Spain" here I am still struggling.

Why do you think you are still strugglling? and what are you struggling with'

Malteser Monkey
17-01-2013, 23:18
No, no, no!:sorry: I just wanted to say I am still young - OK, I am 37 -...learning new things doesn't depend on how old you are

It's ok just a few few few years older mate :D


I can remember being 37, it seems like yesterday. :whistle:

that's a hell of a lot of yesterdays:D


We must sound/chat/type like we're ancient hahahahaha

You said it:bowdown::D



I am :crying2:

Nooo not it you admit it ;)

Javi
17-01-2013, 23:24
I know many people, friends of mine and students of foreign languages, who after having been studied for a while and even having gained an official diploma once they step out away the academy or languages school seem as if they would have lost everything they learnt. In other words, They can't build up sentences in English (or Spanish) and even worse, they are afraid of speak and what comes back.

A few friends have finished their five or six years studies at the Offcial Languages School.

I wonder why it is possible. Any theories? I have one.

Megaloo
17-01-2013, 23:34
Why do you think you are still strugglling? and what are you struggling with'

I used to do homework religously but could never keep it in my brain what I had learned. But I have not given up completely

Javi
18-01-2013, 13:24
I used to do homework religously but could never keep it in my brain what I had learned. But I have not given up completely

Homework needs to be put in context to be meaningful. In order words, have you ever tried to put into practise, in daily situations, what you've learnt?

Megaloo
18-01-2013, 15:11
Homework needs to be put in context to be meaningful. In order words, have you ever tried to put into practise, in daily situations, what you've learnt?

Probably not because I think I get bogged down with verbs and their tenses etc.

cainaries
18-01-2013, 16:19
Probably not because I think I get bogged down with verbs and their tenses etc.

Megaloo ... I cheat a bit with the verbs. I long ago gave up worrying about the rules (sorry, Javi!). If something is happening in the future I just say 'voy a + infinitive'. If it's in the past I use the 'he + past participle' and hardly ever use the other past tenses. What I do find illogical is there is no 'I had had ... 'tense in Spanish. All those tenses and they can't differentiate between 'I have had lunch' and 'I had had lunch'. Not the same thing to me! Cue Javi to come and correct me!

nelson
18-01-2013, 17:56
[QUOTE=Javi;254578]I know many people, friends of mine and students of foreign languages, who after having been studied for a while and even having gained an official diploma once they step out away the academy or languages school seem as if they would have lost everything they learnt. In other words, They can't build up sentences in English (or Spanish) and even worse, they are afraid of speak and what comes back.

A few friends have finished their five or six years studies at the Offcial Languages School.

my problem is since michel tomas I have a very good spanish when i speak out to people, not too bad at all pronunciation etc. this results in the spanaird thinking i am able to listen back at good speed, and then I am undone on occasions. My spanish friends know my limits and though i can speed along and talk out to them well, they still talk back to me slowly and in a more basic manner. This i enjoy very much. Its not the strangers fault that they talk to me quickly, its my own fault and michel thomas,s because , as i say, his learning is so good he has got me a long way, but then it is hard to get fully what comes back at you. If my outgoing spanish was worse , maybe the return speech would be slowe

Javi
19-01-2013, 09:04
my problem is since michel tomas I have a very good spanish when i speak out to people, not too bad at all pronunciation etc. this results in the spanaird thinking i am able to listen back at good speed, and then I am undone on occasions. My spanish friends know my limits and though i can speed along and talk out to them well, they still talk back to me slowly and in a more basic manner. This i enjoy very much. Its not the strangers fault that they talk to me quickly, its my own fault and michel thomas,s because , as i say, his learning is so good he has got me a long way, but then it is hard to get fully what comes back at you. If my outgoing spanish was worse , maybe the return speech would be slowe[/QUOTE]


It's very good for you indeed to have the chance to speak with natives Spanish. Don't ,mind if you can't understand fully what comes back because by practising in real conversations with natives is the way in which your ears and brain will get sooner or later to get a completely understanding or at least, you will be able to catch 80 or 90% of what they are saying. And this is enough. Even in our native language we don't need to pick up the 100% of words to figure out what is coming back to us.

Keep up practising...radio, TV, friends, books...it's cost-effective, maybe a beer or coffe.

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Probably not because I think I get bogged down with verbs and their tenses etc.

So, you know what your weaknesses are. Now you only have to work on it. I like a British saying that state: Nothing ventured, nothing gained. Then, if you don't practise on a daily basis, you will never make mistakes and if you don't make mistakes, you will never learn from them and will never improve your skills too. Doen't matter what skills we are talking about.

How many time have you had to practise and train you swing till you could say I am a golfer now?

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Megaloo ... I cheat a bit with the verbs. I long ago gave up worrying about the rules (sorry, Javi!). If something is happening in the future I just say 'voy a + infinitive'. If it's in the past I use the 'he + past participle' and hardly ever use the other past tenses. What I do find illogical is there is no 'I had had ... 'tense in Spanish. All those tenses and they can't differentiate between 'I have had lunch' and 'I had had lunch'. Not the same thing to me! Cue Javi to come and correct me!

Hi Cainaries, your aproach to the Spanish verb tenses can work, it's mean, people can get what you say.
As a Spanish I wasn't taught on any sort of rules as to how conjugate verbs or when to use one or other article (definite or indefinite). On the contrary, I started to learn grammar once I have a excellent command of speaking, listening and writing at the age of 11 or 12. So, in the time being, forget that lot of rules.

When do you use the Past Perfect in English? Well, our Pretérito Pluscuamperfecto (I had had) works in the same way.

I have had a lunch. Yo he comido/almorzado (Preterito Perfecto Compuesto = Present Perfect). Another meaning is to talk about finished action in the past = Yo comí. This one is commonly used in The Canary Islands, NW of Mainland and in certain countries on South America.
I had had lunch. Yo había comido/almorzado (Pluscuamperfecto) pe.: Yo había comido cuando ella llegó a casa (I had had lunch when she came at home). To talk about something that happenned before another action in the past. I had had lunch also can be translate as Yo hube comido (Pretérito anterior). Good news, this one rarely used on spoken Spanish.

Sorry guys, but it's enough for the forum and...remember you don't need to know such rules

cainaries
19-01-2013, 12:14
Thanks, Javi. I do use the pluperfect in English but I have never heard it used in Spanish. Since my Spanish teacher here on La Palma doesn't speak English I have never managed to explain what it was I was trying to ask her. I had always understood that comí roughly equated (but not really) to he comido and that there wasn't another way to express it.

ribuck
19-01-2013, 13:14
All those tenses and they can't differentiate between 'I have had lunch' and 'I had had lunch'.
In his English exam paper, Javi had "had had". Canaries, where Javi had had "had had", had had "had".

Sorry, couldn't resist.

cainaries
19-01-2013, 15:57
In his English exam paper, Javi had "had had". Canaries, where Javi had had "had had", had had "had".

Sorry, couldn't resist.

Translation into Spanish anyone?

kingbaker
19-01-2013, 23:12
Translation into Spanish anyone?

Someone's been 'had' methinks!!!!:laugh::laugh: :wave:

Javi
19-01-2013, 23:25
Thanks, Javi. I do use the pluperfect in English but I have never heard it used in Spanish. Since my Spanish teacher here on La Palma doesn't speak English I have never managed to explain what it was I was trying to ask her. I had always understood that comí roughly equated (but not really) to he comido and that there wasn't another way to express it.

Comí, in fact, it's very accurate if the action is seen as completed (in the past) or as a single event. As I said in this thread, in some regions on the mainland, on Canaries and in many countries of South America you can also say Yo he comido instead of comí however, the correct tense is comí (preterite indefinite or perfect simple).
A cue: use the preterite indefinite when a time frame like ayer, anoche, antes de ayer, esta tarde, esta mañana, el mes pasado (the list is long) is used.

cainaries
20-01-2013, 12:42
Comí, in fact, it's very accurate if the action is seen as completed (in the past) or as a single event. As I said in this thread, in some regions on the mainland, on Canaries and in many countries of South America you can also say Yo he comido instead of comí however, the correct tense is comí (preterite indefinite or perfect simple).
A cue: use the preterite indefinite when a time frame like ayer, anoche, antes de ayer, esta tarde, esta mañana, el mes pasado (the list is long) is used.

Javi, this is all very well if I am writing something as I can check the list before I write the word. But impossible if I am talking because you can't stop in mid-sentence to run through a whole load of grammar rules in your head before continuing. This is why I stick to my simplistic way of talking in the future or the past!

Javi
20-01-2013, 21:06
Javi, this is all very well if I am writing something as I can check the list before I write the word. But impossible if I am talking because you can't stop in mid-sentence to run through a whole load of grammar rules in your head before continuing. This is why I stick to my simplistic way of talking in the future or the past!

You're absolutely right. I don't pretend anybody learn such list of things (it's a waste of time) but that you can recognize those words when you are reading, listening or writing. Once you've seen and listened to them hundred of times, you will be able to use them straight away without thinking in which verb tense you are using.

If you already have a good command on "simplicity way" why don't you try to go a bit far and put another foot into the Spanish using other tenses?

cainaries
20-01-2013, 22:52
You're absolutely right. I don't pretend anybody learn such list of things (it's a waste of time) but that you can recognize those words when you are reading, listening or writing. Once you've seen and listened to them hundred of times, you will be able to use them straight away without thinking in which verb tense you are using.

If you already have a good command on "simplicity way" why don't you try to go a bit far and put another foot into the Spanish using other tenses?

I do try! I have a little stock of phrases I use often, compré, por ejemplo. The irregular verbs are more difficult. Still remember a conversation I had with a neighbour who was telling me Spanish was easy (yes, learned at your mother's knee, of course it is). So I asked why you don't say 'dormo' (from dormir) and she looked at me in surprise and confessed she'd never thought about it. Even better she used usted to her father but tu to her mother. Aagh. How can we tell from that. We use usted to everyone even to each other to avoid causing offence!

CAROL R
21-01-2013, 14:53
I found the best way for me was to watch the childrens tv programmes on Spanish tv. My theory being that if kids can learn so can we. The other thing I did was to get my fave DVD and put it on in Spanish with English subtitles and keep watching it.

I am fairly fluent but my grammer is not correct having never had actual lessons

Javi
21-01-2013, 15:33
I do try! I have a little stock of phrases I use often, compré, por ejemplo. The irregular verbs are more difficult. Still remember a conversation I had with a neighbour who was telling me Spanish was easy (yes, learned at your mother's knee, of course it is). So I asked why you don't say 'dormo' (from dormir) and she looked at me in surprise and confessed she'd never thought about it. Even better she used usted to her father but tu to her mother. Aagh. How can we tell from that. We use usted to everyone even to each other to avoid causing offence!

Your neighbour doesn't know the answer to your question simply because she don't need to know it. Nobody need to know that only a lecturer does. Our approach to a second language must be easier and effortless, more automaticly without involving a big thinking process.

Adults tend to learn more focused on grammar that on listening, comprehension and conversation skills. That the way in which children learn.

Usted vs tu. Doesn't matter what you use. Nobody's going to be offended. In certain countries of South America (Perú, Ecuador, ...) even parents say usted when they adress to their children.

In theory, usted is used when we meet someone for the first time / if you want to show respect towards sb / if you want to create a "distance" with others / to adress to older (very common in Canary to show respect)...but it's just the theory.
We don't see "tu" as informal (it's) or impolite.

slodgedad
21-01-2013, 15:56
This may be slightly off topic but, regardless of how much tuition you have and degrees earned, nothing subsitutes use.

My daughter has lived here since she was 3 in 1994 and went to English school.

Her Spanish, because we always lived in a Brit environment, was 'schoolboy' Spanish.

Since leaving school, and going out with her Spanish friends, she is now regarded as a local (with a Brit accent) by her contempories.

Her Spanish is immaculate and accurate but still accented.

I wish I had put her in Spanish school when we first came. (I think, secretely, that she feels the same.

Sorry for the drivvle, but the point I'm making is, that without practice and use you can study anything in the classroom.

But it means nothing til you learn how to use it.!

cainaries
21-01-2013, 16:02
This may be slightly off topic but, regardless of how much tuition you have and degrees earned, nothing subsitutes use.

My daughter has lived here since she was 3 in 1994 and went to English school.

Her Spanish, because we always lived in a Brit environment, was 'schoolboy' Spanish.

Since leaving school, and going out with her Spanish friends, she is now regarded as a local (with a Brit accent) by her contempories.

Her Spanish is immaculate and accurate but still accented.

I wish I had put her in Spanish school when we first came. (I think, secretely, that she feels the same.

Sorry for the drivvle, but the point I'm making is, that without practice and use you can study anything in the classroom.

But it means nothing til you learn how to use it.!

Not off topic, I don't think! Must be difficult for everyone to choose Spanish or English schooling.

As for tu vs usted, I can promise you, Javi, there are people here in hillbilly country who can be offended. I can always tell because I have occasionally used 'tu'to someone to test the water and the other person has solemnly continued with 'usted' and not changed to tu (tutu much here). I have exactly the same problems with Germans and 'du'.

slodgedad
21-01-2013, 16:33
Not oar less obliff topic, I don't think! Must be difficult for everyone to choose Spanish or English schooling.

As for tu vs usted, I can promise you, Javi, there are people here in hillbilly country who can be offended. I can always tell because I have occasionally used 'tu'to someone to test the water and the other person has solemnly continued with 'usted' and not changed to tu (tutu much here). I have exactly the same problems with Germans and 'du'.

I have found Deutch y Francais far less obliging, linguistically, than Spanish.

Spaniards will not pick you up on minor mistakes where F&Ks will. (Knocks the confidence out of you)

Malteser Monkey
21-01-2013, 16:51
I have found Deutch y Francais far less obliging, linguistically, than Spanish.

Spaniards will not pick you up on minor mistakes where F&Ks will. (Knocks the confidence out of you)

I agree Slodgie - my knowledge of verb formats is what really let's me down - but I always found I could make myself understood and I was never picked up on my usage of Usted and Tu.

F & K's took me a sec to get you there:whistle:

Medman
21-01-2013, 17:03
I agree Slodgie - my knowledge of verb formats is what really let's me down - but I always found I could make myself understood and I was never picked up on my usage of Usted and Tu.

F & K's took me a sec to get you there:whistle:

What's Fries and Ketchup got to do with this ?

Malteser Monkey
21-01-2013, 17:06
What's Fries and Ketchup got to do with this ?

:laugh::crazy:

Medman
21-01-2013, 17:18
:laugh::crazy:

I was going to learn Spanish, but when I found out that beer wasn't beer, that was enough for me !

SueB
21-01-2013, 17:36
Hi all,
Thought I'd share my experiences too. I started learning Spanish at night school in England when we first thought about buying in Tenerife - over 5 years ago now.
I admit there is a lot of grammar and not enough speaking at first, but persevere it does get better. I am by no means fluent but can hold my own in a conversation and understand 90% of what is said. I am halfway through my Spanish A Level now, and looking forward to learning more. Ana my lovely (Venezuelan) Spanish teacher is now a great friend and we can chat about most things, she rarely corrects my speaking (unless I inadvertently come out with something hilarious or vulgar!) but she does make a few notes, and tries to cover my mistakes in the next lesson. The biggest issue is getting people to speak to you in Spanish in Tenerife, you have to persevere and once you realise that you are being understood your confidence will grow.
Even speaking Spanish to other non native speakers of other nationalities helps, my neighbours in Tenerife are Latvian, and it seems perfectly natural to us to converse in Spanish!

Sue

PS I've just celebrated my half century!

Fivepence
21-01-2013, 17:45
Hi all,
Thought I'd share my experiences too. I started learning Spanish at night school in England when we first thought about buying in Tenerife - over 5 years ago now.
I admit there is a lot of grammar and not enough speaking at first, but persevere it does get better. I am by no means fluent but can hold my own in a conversation and understand 90% of what is said. I am halfway through my Spanish A Level now, and looking forward to learning more. Ana my lovely (Venezuelan) Spanish teacher is now a great friend and we can chat about most things, she rarely corrects my speaking (unless I inadvertently come out with something hilarious or vulgar!) but she does make a few notes, and tries to cover my mistakes in the next lesson. The biggest issue is getting people to speak to you in Spanish in Tenerife, you have to persevere and once you realise that you are being understood your confidence will grow.
Even speaking Spanish to other non native speakers of other nationalities helps, my neighbours in Tenerife are Latvian, and it seems perfectly natural to us to converse in Spanish!

Sue

PS I've just celebrated my half century!

Happy Birthday and best wishes Sue, 50 is not old..........if your 60! :whistle:

Malteser Monkey
21-01-2013, 17:45
Hi all,
Thought I'd share my experiences too. I started learning Spanish at night school in England when we first thought about buying in Tenerife - over 5 years ago now.
I admit there is a lot of grammar and not enough speaking at first, but persevere it does get better. I am by no means fluent but can hold my own in a conversation and understand 90% of what is said. I am halfway through my Spanish A Level now, and looking forward to learning more. Ana my lovely (Venezuelan) Spanish teacher is now a great friend and we can chat about most things, she rarely corrects my speaking (unless I inadvertently come out with something hilarious or vulgar!) but she does make a few notes, and tries to cover my mistakes in the next lesson. The biggest issue is getting people to speak to you in Spanish in Tenerife, you have to persevere and once you realise that you are being understood your confidence will grow.
Even speaking Spanish to other non native speakers of other nationalities helps, my neighbours in Tenerife are Latvian, and it seems perfectly natural to us to converse in Spanish!

Sue

PS I've just celebrated my half century!

Well you are amongst many others on here :whistle: excluding me

Happy Birthday Sue B from Mrs Cheeky:cheeky:

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Happy Birthday and best wishes Sue, 50 is not old..........if your 60! :whistle:

More like 70 :raspberry2:

chifleta
21-01-2013, 18:50
This may be slightly off topic but, regardless of how much tuition you have and degrees earned, nothing subsitutes use.

My daughter has lived here since she was 3 in 1994 and went to English school.

Her Spanish, because we always lived in a Brit environment, was 'schoolboy' Spanish.

Since leaving school, and going out with her Spanish friends, she is now regarded as a local (with a Brit accent) by her contempories.

Her Spanish is immaculate and accurate but still accented.

I wish I had put her in Spanish school when we first came. (I think, secretely, that she feels the same.

Sorry for the drivvle, but the point I'm making is, that without practice and use you can study anything in the classroom.

But it means nothing til you learn how to use it.!

Works both ways... my lad (half Canarian, half Brit) has always been in a Spanish environment/school so he is fluent with a Canarian accent... his English (partly my fault this bit) is very schoolboy, with a Spanish accent... though he used to be able to do a good Scottish accent when he was younger LOL

warbey
21-01-2013, 21:13
This is interesting to Me. The Experiences of Slodge and Chifleta.

This is a great Thread to read if You were Moving to Tenerife
and had Children who were School Age or younger.
Ten years on, what is Your FIRST Language.?

cainaries
21-01-2013, 22:38
I have found Deutch y Francais far less obliging, linguistically, than Spanish.

Spaniards will not pick you up on minor mistakes where F&Ks will. (Knocks the confidence out of you)

Agree with you about the F's, Slodgie, but here the K's are so relieved I can speak K at all that they never mention the mistakes (which are legion).

But there is still this blasted tu/usted tu/vous du/sie dilemma and I just can't understand why it matters but it does seem to. Also, I can't remember the plural of du in K so that's another problem. bit like vosotros.

Malteser Monkey
22-01-2013, 10:37
Agree with you about the F's, Slodgie, but here the K's are so relieved I can speak K at all that they never mention the mistakes (which are legion).

But there is still this blasted tu/usted tu/vous du/sie dilemma and I just can't understand why it matters but it does seem to. Also, I can't remember the plural of du in K so that's another problem. bit like vosotros.

Why it matters C or what the ruling is hun ?

cainaries
22-01-2013, 12:03
Why it matters C or what the ruling is hun ?

There certainly aren't any rules about when you can use tu or usted, if only there were! When I started playing cards with some over-wintering Germans about the second thing they said to me was that everyone in the card school (sounds like an American movie now) .. anyway, everyone used 'du'. So that was clear from the get-go. I once asked a German friend if I could use 'du' and she said 'not yet' and about two years later she told me I could! The only risk is that you can offend someone by being over-familiar or equally offend them by seeming stand-offish.

Coffee?

Malteser Monkey
22-01-2013, 12:11
There certainly aren't any rules about when you can use tu or usted, if only there were! When I started playing cards with some over-wintering Germans about the second thing they said to me was that everyone in the card school (sounds like an American movie now) .. anyway, everyone used 'du'. So that was clear from the get-go. I once asked a German friend if I could use 'du' and she said 'not yet' and about two years later she told me I could! The only risk is that you can offend someone by being over-familiar or equally offend them by seeming stand-offish.

Coffee?

Si por favor y quiere usted una galleta.... now would you be offended at that mujer :cheeky:

You see I was told that for friends and younger people it's Tu for people in authority - or elders it's Usted - I've always gone with that

Someone will jump in now and tell me different won't they

Sundowner
22-01-2013, 12:43
Agree with you about the F's, Slodgie, but here the K's are so relieved I can speak K at all that they never mention the mistakes (which are legion).

But there is still this blasted tu/usted tu/vous du/sie dilemma and I just can't understand why it matters but it does seem to. Also, I can't remember the plural of du in K so that's another problem. bit like vosotros.


plural ihr :wink:

cainaries
22-01-2013, 12:45
Si por favor y quiere usted una galleta.... now would you be offended at that mujer :cheeky:

You see I was told that for friends and younger people it's Tu for people in authority - or elders it's Usted - I've always gone with that

Someone will jump in now and tell me different won't they

Hmm... yes, please, I'd love a biscuit or two. Did you mean 'usted' for older people and people in authority? Of course, we are all older than you, MM, so you would probably have to use usted to most of us.:laugh:rolleyes2:

SueB .. I am incredibly impressed that you have got to Spanish A level in 5 years.:respect::bowdown:

Malteser Monkey
22-01-2013, 12:50
Hmm... yes, please, I'd love a biscuit or two. Did you mean 'usted' for older people and people in authority? Of course, we are all older than you, MM, so you would probably have to use usted to most of us.:laugh:rolleyes2:

SueB .. I am incredibly impressed that you have got to Spanish A level in 5 years.:respect::bowdown:

Well I wasn't going to bring that up again C but seeing as you have yes Ustedes, claro !

I got my O level in a year - what about me:whistle:

Seriously well done SueB saw that a lot of literature to get through ?

cainaries
22-01-2013, 14:48
plural ihr :wink:

As the subject of the verb? What's Euch then? (Sorry, no need to answer, I do know this is a Spanish language thread not a multi-national one).

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Well I wasn't going to bring that up again C but seeing as you have yes Ustedes, claro !

I got my O level in a year - what about me:whistle:

Seriously well done SueB saw that a lot of literature to get through ?

How can you be old enough to have an 'O' level? Hmmm? (Well done, though. I have an A* GCSE but I'm not sure that's really much to boast about).

Malteser Monkey
22-01-2013, 15:04
As the subject of the verb? What's Euch then? (Sorry, no need to answer, I do know this is a Spanish language thread not a multi-national one).

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How can you be old enough to have an 'O' level? Hmmm? (Well done, though. I have an A* GCSE but I'm not sure that's really much to boast about).


Sorry they were GCSE O Level when I was at school but when I took this exam it was a GCSE and snap * -first ever good result:o

SueB
22-01-2013, 17:26
Seriously well done SueB saw that a lot of literature to get through ?

Yes but once you get to the literature, art and films, that's is when it starts to get enjoyable and when you realise how much you actually know. I don't enjoy the exams themselves, but having something to work towards does concentrate the mind! I don't think I would have the will power to carry on learning without something to aim for.

Sundowner
22-01-2013, 17:50
As the subject of the verb? What's Euch then? (Sorry, no need to answer, I do know this is a Spanish language thread not a multi-national one).

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How can you be old enough to have an 'O' level? Hmmm? (Well done, though. I have an A* GCSE but I'm not sure that's really much to boast about).

Euch is accusative/dative