PDA

View Full Version : Advice wanted I'm looking for advice on running a bar in the Canaries



mini--c
11-08-2013, 22:23
Hi I know most people will say don't do it but I am looking into opening or taken over a bar in the canaries! I no this is the Tenerife forum by I'm sure the laws and costs involved don't differ to much. I would like some help info with any unexpected costs to be aware of, what barriers to expect to face and any general advice and things to look out for. Also I have savings but how hard is it to get a business or personal loan in the canaries?

Thanks.

murph
11-08-2013, 23:19
Buy this book, laugh out loud and then don't do it!!

http://www.amazon.co.uk/More-Ketchup-than-Salsa-ebook/dp/B004VFP47E/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1376259472&sr=8-1&keywords=more+ketchup+than+salsa

zumba queen
12-08-2013, 01:02
Give it a go because you will always wonder what if,also why spend money elsewhere when Tenerife has everything going for it.just before the doomasters attack me look at some of the bars that have opened i.e Taylors,Shambles,Buddies,Manhattan etc now if all the owners of these bars thought **** it we will try somewhere else Tenerife would be worse off,so long live (new & old blood) but please take care and listen to the good advice from some of members on here.

cressrt
12-08-2013, 08:05
Have a read of this http://tenerifeestateagents.net/bars-for-sale-in-tenerife-warning/

golf birdie
12-08-2013, 10:21
[QUOTE=zumba queen;309452] look at some of the bars that have opened i.e Taylors,Shambles,Buddies,Manhattan etc QUOTE]

correct me if I am wrong but at least two of them bars were opened by people who lived in Tenerife for many years before opening their bar. They had a very good idea of what running a business took over here and lots of contacts. Landing here and trying to do this is a huge mistake which has cost many, many people their life savings.

trevorife2
12-08-2013, 11:06
Surely if people keep getting told be careful or dont bother or even get laughed at then there will be thousands of empty places in a few yrs ??? All i can say even though idont live in tenerife but as a business owner in the uk is if you have the confidence to open a bar then do it and be one of the success stories that we read about ...

golf birdie
12-08-2013, 11:23
Surely if people keep getting told be careful or dont bother or even get laughed at then there will be thousands of empty places in a few yrs ??? All i can say even though idont live in tenerife but as a business owner in the uk is if you have the confidence to open a bar then do it and be one of the success stories that we read about ...

I would never say don't do it to anyone who has built a successful business as to have done so they must of listened to advice. The problem is most people do not take any notice of the advice or warning signs. One example is of a family I met a few years back who wanted a bar and fell in love with one that was on the market. When they told me of how much the rent was I almost fell off my chair. I told them it would be impossible to make it work no matter how good they were. They went and signed for the bar the very next day. One year and over 50K later they left the island pottless. The man said to me he would never of made this mistake in the UK as he knew the market there. The sun does blind a lot of people here.

primrose
12-08-2013, 11:24
Surely if people keep getting told be careful or dont bother or even get laughed at then there will be thousands of empty places in a few yrs ??? All i can say even though idont live in tenerife but as a business owner in the uk is if you have the confidence to open a bar then do it and be one of the success stories that we read about ...

There are thousands of empty places now because the people that owned them couldn't make them work lost everything and went back to the UK, and what aren't empty are up for sale, and somebody coming on here and asking about running a Bar in Tenerife and asking how easy it is to get a Business or Personal loan before they even get a Bar really has no idea of what moving and working here entails. I have read so many times on here Just go for it don't spend your life wondering what if,but there are hundreds of families back in the UK wondering what if I hadn't gone to Tenerife and opened a Bar I would still have my house and savings.Come over and look for yourself at the empty Bars and the Bars with nobody in and then make a decision but for goodness sake don't even think of getting a loan for a Business here.

casabonny
12-08-2013, 11:41
In general , you have to be a very established and profitable business for a bank to offer you a loan or overdraft. They are available but not to new businesses only to those that the bank and/or the government consider are stable and profitable and can pay them back, but of course no one has a crystal ball so its a risk anyway for both the banks and the borrowers.
Over the last twelve months we have been offered three separate loans from our business bank with differing terms and conditions , some were specifically only for one thing , another could be spent on anything we wanted, if we had taken them.
As a newbie though a business loan is neigh on impossible.
Running a bar , requires experience not only in the trade ( perhaps as a manager or bar staff member) , but a good sound business head too, knowing when to take risks and when to play it safe. Life is an experience that we all learn from.

tracey
12-08-2013, 11:45
I have not run a bar in Tenerife but I do have a business. My only advice would be to speak to a well established Tenerife lawyer before you commit to anything. Its well worth the money to get a real idea of the costs and possible pitfalls.

Good luck :)

TOPGUN77
12-08-2013, 11:57
If I where you keep your money safe there are far to many bars in Tenerife as it is, I have seen so many close down where they couldn't make it work.At the end of the day its your money and decision.Same thing in the UK I have never seen so many bars go under so no difference over here aswell.

KirstyJay
12-08-2013, 12:06
First of all, forget a loan. If you don't have the money to start and run a business yourself for the first year, don't do it.

If you do want to go ahead and have your own capital, do not pay a traspaso or buy anywhere. There are so many places empty nowadays you'd be a fool to accept any premises where the owner doesn't accept rent only.

Negotiate the rent. Don't take the first offer. Look at a few places and play them off against each other if you have to. The market's in your favour at the moment. Use that fact. If you speak Spanish or have a person who is fluent that can accompany you, do so. You'll get a lot further.

You'll need to go to the Ayuntamiento and get an opening licence. Cost of this can vary. Ours was about 180€. It depends on what your business activity is, as to the price.

To get your opening licence you will need to get a project done by a registered architectural engineer. This can cost anything from 150€ to 1000€ depending on the premises and what you will use them for.

You will also need a new boletín for the electrics (this is a quite recent edition) which is done for 'the activity you are using the premises for'.

You will also need a certificate of the architectural soundness of the building (this is a new one too, as we've just been asked to provide it in order for our licence to be processed).

If you will be serving drinks and food you'll need the appropriate licences from the ayuntamiento and any food preparation certificates, such as the certificado de manipuladores de alimentos.

You will also need to make sure you Alta autonomo in RETA and get a Gestor to sort out your Pago fraccionado every quarter. All people that work for you will also need contracts sorted out so that you don't get fined if you have an inspection.

You can open without the opening licence, as long as you have proof that you have presented the documentation needed and it's in process. I will advise you now to get a paper signed and stamped as receipt for EVERY piece of paper you present because things can, and will get lost!

Oh, and do t expect to get anything done in August.

Good luck! :D

junglejim
12-08-2013, 13:25
Sounds like a "Don´t Bother " to me Kirsty ! What a nightmare !
The ubiquitous video as well !

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2wtbQUaC9mE

Malteser Monkey
12-08-2013, 13:40
Sounds like a "Don´t Bother " to me Kirsty ! What a nightmare !
The ubiquitous video as well !

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2wtbQUaC9mE

that is brilliant !

Muppet
12-08-2013, 14:25
I have not run a bar in Tenerife but I do have a business. My only advice would be to speak to a well established Tenerife lawyer before you commit to anything. Its well worth the money to get a real idea of the costs and possible pitfalls.

Good luck :)

Most Tenerife lawyers are well established, it's finding one who will tell you the truth, not tell you what they think you want to hear.

Lucy Skymonds
20-11-2013, 00:02
Don't let people get you down, just use their comments to be super careful about your business choice! Tourists are spending more money now than in the past 5 or more years (crazy to think, considering how much everyone has been suffering, but completely true nonetheless). The tourist market is going more upscale, so keep in mind this changing market when making your decision. Also, some insider info: stay away from veronicas (very popular atm for bars and clubs), the police are intent on shutting the smaller bars down to make way for papagayo - they're hasselling small bars on a Friday night to turn down their volume to 60 decibels, so it may not be a wise place to invest lol! In regards to what some of the other people are saying about being a local and knowing the market - I would agree up to a point, but the most necessary thing to have is a hell of alot of industry experience and know how of the Spanish system really works in relations to bars. If you don't have this knowledge, then I would deeply encourage you to scout out a potential partner to help you run and manage the business. I may know someone interested in a future partnership; he's had over 10 years industry experience in Tenerife in bartending, ownership and management :) Best of luck to whatever you decide on doing in the end! :D

doreen
20-11-2013, 16:00
Don't let people get you down, just use their comments to be super careful about your business choice! Tourists are spending more money now than in the past 5 or more years (crazy to think, considering how much everyone has been suffering, but completely true nonetheless). The tourist market is going more upscale, so keep in mind this changing market when making your decision. Also, some insider info: stay away from veronicas (very popular atm for bars and clubs), the police are intent on shutting the smaller bars down to make way for papagayo - they're hasselling small bars on a Friday night to turn down their volume to 60 decibels, so it may not be a wise place to invest lol! In regards to what some of the other people are saying about being a local and knowing the market - I would agree up to a point, but the most necessary thing to have is a hell of alot of industry experience and know how of the Spanish system really works in relations to bars. If you don't have this knowledge, then I would deeply encourage you to scout out a potential partner to help you run and manage the business. I may know someone interested in a future partnership; he's had over 10 years industry experience in Tenerife in bartending, ownership and management :) Best of luck to whatever you decide on doing in the end! :D

Really ? No favouritism shown to Papaygao this Saturday - police there making sure it, and all other bars in the area, were closed by 4 am.

9PLUS
20-11-2013, 18:36
First of all, forget a loan. If you don't have the money to start and run a business yourself for the first year, don't do it.

If you do want to go ahead and have your own capital, do not pay a traspaso or buy anywhere. There are so many places empty nowadays you'd be a fool to accept any premises where the owner doesn't accept rent only.

Negotiate the rent. Don't take the first offer. Look at a few places and play them off against each other if you have to. The market's in your favour at the moment. Use that fact. If you speak Spanish or have a person who is fluent that can accompany you, do so. You'll get a lot further.

You'll need to go to the Ayuntamiento and get an opening licence. Cost of this can vary. Ours was about 180€. It depends on what your business activity is, as to the price.

To get your opening licence you will need to get a project done by a registered architectural engineer. This can cost anything from 150€ to 1000€ depending on the premises and what you will use them for.

You will also need a new boletín for the electrics (this is a quite recent edition) which is done for 'the activity you are using the premises for'.

You will also need a certificate of the architectural soundness of the building (this is a new one too, as we've just been asked to provide it in order for our licence to be processed).

If you will be serving drinks and food you'll need the appropriate licences from the ayuntamiento and any food preparation certificates, such as the certificado de manipuladores de alimentos.

You will also need to make sure you Alta autonomo in RETA and get a Gestor to sort out your Pago fraccionado every quarter. All people that work for you will also need contracts sorted out so that you don't get fined if you have an inspection.

You can open without the opening licence, as long as you have proof that you have presented the documentation needed and it's in process. I will advise you now to get a paper signed and stamped as receipt for EVERY piece of paper you present because things can, and will get lost!

Oh, and do t expect to get anything done in August.

Good luck! :D



Bar Traspasos used to be for any bar equipment that was in the local then kind of snuck its way into the worth of a business, many will not or will negotiate away the traspaso now especially if they are desperate to get rid of the bar or you are dealing directly with the owner. But expect to pay something if the bar comes with equipment.

No too sure where Kirsty gets her project prices from? be prepared to pay €1800 upwards (€2000-€2500 is around the going rate up to say 200 M2) for the project, stamped, taxes paid in Industria, processing costs and most important the fin de obra. When getting a quotations make sure they specify the fin de obra more so if you're not going direct to the engineer.

More than likely you would need to rewire the local up to the current regulations if the existing installation was done over 10 years (pre 2002/3) as well as the Electrical certification (boletin)

Adeje are one of the best townhalls to do business in where the electrical installations are concerned, there's a few if's & but's, but in certain cases you wouldn't have to do anything/much to the existing installation.

If the local doesn't comply with any rules and regs have €50000 in your pocket to get you through the year for a 100M2 bar.

Lucy Skymonds
21-11-2013, 22:16
Really ? No favouritism shown to Papaygao this Saturday - police there making sure it, and all other bars in the area, were closed by 4 am.

There's a new head of police and apparently she does everything by the book and is really cracking down on corruption, so I'm not really surprised she would shut down Papagayo at 4, if that's what their license allows... what I was trying to get at is that high end places like Papagayo do get allowances that some of the smaller bars might not, like being able to play loud music, because the government is trying to encourage a new type of tourist :P

Stoney
21-11-2013, 23:23
Over the last couple of years, plenty of bars have changed hands and then after a few months they are closed. The only people who seem to keep going are the ones that sell good cheap food and have entertainment and cater for the youngsters. My advice would be to come on holiday for at least a month and have a good look around the busy areas from 11pm to late, then try to speak to as many of the owners you can find. Don't forget that to if you don't speak fluent Spanish then you must take someone you know and trust with you who does, otherwise you will get ripped off. We had some friends that bought a beach bar and was making a success of it, then the authorites came and closed it for a breach of regulations which the seller knew about, so if you do go ahead be very very careful.

9PLUS
21-11-2013, 23:47
Medano ?........

LUCKY
22-11-2013, 11:07
QUOTE=cressrt;309481]Have a read of this http://tenerifeestateagents.net/bars-for-sale-in-tenerife-warning/[/QUOTE]
Thank you , What a lovely read, opens up ones eyes doesnt it:flatcap::feret::feret:

Blackpeter
23-11-2013, 00:07
i wouldnt do it if i was paid u either make it or u dont its simple

kathml
23-11-2013, 11:18
Don't ever take a partner that's the way to an early bankruptcy

If you haven't enough faith in yourself and enough money (and you need enough for two years) forget it

deepdivejunkie
23-11-2013, 17:48
Have a read of this...
http://tenerifeestateagents.net/bars-for-sale-in-tenerife-warning/

Westminster
23-11-2013, 18:32
There is an old saying 'A fool and his money are soon parted'.

Tenerife certainly does not need anymore bars, especially English bars with their pints, etc.

Consider a business that is unique to an area and you will have more chance of success.