Brexit relocation advice please

[Karlmoose]

My wife and myself lived in Tenerife for ten years,but have been living back in the uk for three years now and have decided to return to Tenerife in September to live again but are a bit worried about possible entry problems if Britain leaves the eu in June,we both still have our old green a4 paper residencias but not sure if they will still count for anything,if anybody can shed any light on this situation it would be most appreciated...thanks.

[doreen]

A couple of points Karl ... even if it is a vote to leave the EU, it will be a two year process of negotiation: as this would be the first time a country has requested to exit the EU, no one is quite sure of what the ramifications will be, certainly nothing will be known by next September.

Secondly, it would be a question of how you left things on your departure from Tenerife: did you deregister or just leave. Were either of you an autonomo (self employed) - if you did not formally deregister (baja) as an autonomo, you might find you come back to a large bill which you will have to sort out/appeal before you open a bank account (or an amount of your money could be embargoed till this matter is sorted)

Residencias no longer exist as such, it is a certificate of registration. Since March (?) 2012, there are new rules that you must prove circa 5,000 euros per person in your bank account and private health insurance if you do not have a work contract ... as to whether these new conditions would apply to you, I could not say.

Can I suggest you contact a member here Goldenmaniac who is a qualified assessora and should be able to confirm your position once you advise on whether you deregistered etc. A few years back, she helped a friend of mine deal with a major bill for an autonomo who was not properly baja'd.

[willowlily]

so does a Spanish couple or indeed any other European person who wish to live in the uk have to lodge sterling equivalent 5000 euros in uk bank account
do they also have to take out private insurance unless they have a work contract.

[doreen]

so does a Spanish couple or indeed any other European person who wish to live in the uk have to lodge sterling equivalent 5000 euros in uk bank account
do they also have to take out private insurance unless they have a work contract.

No, the UK and Spain have differing systems regarding Health Care and Social Security payments. For Spain, see here (http://www.boe.es/boe/dias/2012/07/10/pdfs/BOE-A-2012-9218.pdf)

When I rented long term in the UK a few years ago, there was no regulation, as there is in Spain, that I had to register at the Police Department after 3 months, but I did have to pay Council Tax, which in Westminister was quite steep !

EDIT: ... and before someone says - everyone pays Council Tax, well in Spain, the equivalent, IBI, is only paid by owners, not renters, so all countries have differing regulations :)

[Karlmoose]

Thanks very much Doreen

[bulldog]

A couple of points Karl ... even if it is a vote to leave the EU, it will be a two year process of negotiation: as this would be the first time a country has requested to exit the EU, no one is quite sure of what the ramifications will be, certainly nothing will be known by next September.

Secondly, it would be a question of how you left things on your departure from Tenerife: did you deregister or just leave. Were either of you an autonomo (self employed) - if you did not formally deregister (baja) as an autonomo, you might find you come back to a large bill which you will have to sort out/appeal before you open a bank account (or an amount of your money could be embargoed till this matter is sorted)

Residencias no longer exist as such, it is a certificate of registration. Since March (?) 2012, there are new rules that you must prove circa 5,000 euros per person in your bank account and private health insurance if you do not have a work contract ... as to whether these new conditions would apply to you, I could not say.

Can I suggest you contact a member here Goldenmaniac who is a qualified assessora and should be able to confirm your position once you advise on whether you deregistered etc. A few years back, she helped a friend of mine deal with a major bill for an autonomo who was not properly baja'd.
Doreen is 100% right if the U,K. leave E.U. nobody knows what will happen regarding expats ,but we all know if you fall out with friend they can quickly come
your worst enemy so lets stay in :)

[essexeddie]

Doreen is 100% right if the U,K. leave E.U. nobody knows what will happen regarding expats ,but we all know if you fall out with friend they can quickly come
your worst enemy so lets stay in :)



You obviously speak for yourself. I own a Spanish property but I'm still voting out. Its a bigger picture.



From a well known statesman
"The most puzzling development in politics during the last decade is the apparent determination of Western European leaders to recreate the Soviet Union in Western Europe."
― Mikhail Gorbachev.......

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[bulldog]

You obviously speak for yourself. I own a Spanish property but I'm still voting out. Its a bigger picture.


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I can,t see owning a property in Spain will affect you lots of non E.U. citizens own in Spain, living and working in Tenerife for 30 years I,m going to see a different
picture than you

[essexeddie]

I can,t see owning a property in Spain will affect you lots of non E.U. citizens own in Spain, living and working in Tenerife for 30 years I,m going to see a different
picture than you

Glad you said that because that's exactly my point. Non British will have a different view on Brexit. You have to live in the UK to see what a disaster the EU has been, and it will get a lot worse believe you me.


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[Hepa]

I doubt if Spain or any other E.U. country, will object to immigrants from none E.U. countries, providing they have the means to support themselves, contribute to the economy and are not a burden on the healthcare system, by having private healthcare or contributing to the Convenio Especial.

I don't think you need to worry, in or out, plenty of people came to Spain before Spain joined the E.U.

[jack oakley]

{{Quote}} Residencias no longer exist as such, it is a certificate of registration. Since March (?) 2012, there are new rules that you must prove circa 5,000 euros per person in your bank account and private health insurance if you do not have a work contract ... as to whether these new conditions would apply to you, I could not say. {{quote}}

The above quote say's it all, Spain is part of the E.U. yet it can insist on anyone wishing to live here having to meet the criteria of having to prove they are self sufficient with 5000 euros per bod in the bank and private health insurance. We wouldn't need a brexit referendum If the United Kingdom adopted and INSISTED on the same criteria.... the one million Poles already in residence and the 27 million Turks, 16 million Romanians, 16 million Bulgarians and one million ISIS members disguised as asylum seekers from Syria and Afghanistan queuing up to board the Eurostar would sod off to Saudi Arabia or Russia.:doh:

[doreen]

The above quote say's it all, Spain is part of the E.U. yet it can insist on anyone wishing to live here having to meet the criteria of having to prove they are self sufficient with 5000 euros per bod in the bank and private health insurance. We wouldn't need a brexit referendum If the United Kingdom adopted and INSISTED on the same criteria.... the one million Poles already in residence and the 27 million Turks, 16 million Romanians, 16 million Bulgarians and one million ISIS members disguised as asylum seekers from Syria and Afghanistan queuing up to board the Eurostar would sod off to Saudi Arabia or Russia.:doh:


Come on Jack ... do a little research before spouting such crazy numbers ... it is estimated that the total number of ISIS fighters is below 100,000 ... Russian security sources (http://heavy.com/news/2015/11/how-many-fighters-militants-jihadist-soldiers-are-in-isis-islamic-state-nationalities-where-do-they-come-from-numbers/) put it nearer 80,000.

So even if every single one of them left the battle area to "queue up at Eurostar" your figure would still be pure hyperbole !

[jack oakley]

Doreen the whole subject of Brexit whenever or wherever it is mentioned is overflowing with 'hyperbole', the last people I would expect to be truthful would be the Russian security bods. Of course my post was quoting 'crazy numbers' and I apologise if I have annoyed you in any way, me thinks I would rather face a battalion of ISIS bods than wrent your wrath..

[phillip]

Europe is a much safer place than it was some years ago and it seems that main 'brexit' argument is centred around immigration and benefits. The benefits system in the UK is far more generous than the vast majority of other EU countries and there seems to lie a large part of the problem. Another problem has been the inclusion of some eastern european nations (and Greece) whose economies were not subject to enough scrutiny before being granted membership and this resulted in freedom of movement turning into east to west one way traffic.
Having said all that I class myself as a european brit and I do not care about the nationality of people who are hardworking and contribute to whichever country they reside - i sincerely hope we vote to 'remain' as the benefits far outweigh the minuses. Better to try to influence change from within, rather than heckle from the sidelines!

[willowlily]

Europe is a much safer place than it was some years ago and it seems that main 'brexit' argument is centred around immigration and benefits. The benefits system in the UK is far more generous than the vast majority of other EU countries and there seems to lie a large part of the problem. Another problem has been the inclusion of some eastern european nations (and Greece) whose economies were not subject to enough scrutiny before being granted membership and this resulted in freedom of movement turning into east to west one way traffic.
Having said all that I class myself as a european brit and I do not care about the nationality of people who are hardworking and contribute to whichever country they reside - i sincerely hope we vote to 'remain' as the benefits far outweigh the minuses. Better to try to influence change from within, rather than heckle from the sidelines!


well don't hold your breathe because we have been trying to influence change since we joined, and 75 out of 75 times we have been out voted. the fact is the eu will not reform and we have lost patience
we are not heckling from the sidelines any more

[phillip]

We may have been out voted.....but that is democracy. There is no publicity on how many times other EU countries have been out voted on various issues. At the end of the day we all have one vote to decide whether our future lies with retaining our close ties to our european partners....or isolationism. My choice is 'remain' but I respect the alternative view, even though I do not agree with it.

[essexeddie]

I doubt if Spain or any other E.U. country, will object to immigrants from none E.U. countries, providing they have the means to support themselves, contribute to the economy and are not a burden on the healthcare system, by having private healthcare or contributing to the Convenio Especial.



Absolutely agree but sadly our system has been badly abused and will get a whole lot worse when Turkey are given visa's in October. We would be stark raving mad to stay in. If we do then we disserve all that's coming to us.


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[delderek]

Absolutely agree but sadly our system has been badly abused and will get a whole lot worse when Turkey are given visa's in October. We would be stark raving mad to stay in. If we do then we disserve all that's coming to us.


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Turkey seems to be used often as the frightener. In reality as a Sunni Muslim country it will be years and years if ever that they are allowed to join. In my opinion it will never happen. The Visa's that are being granted are for 30days only, as blackmail for looking after the refugees.

[willowlily]

Turkey seems to be used often as the frightener. In reality as a Sunni Muslim country it will be years and years if ever that they are allowed to join. In my opinion it will never happen. The Visa's that are being granted are for 30days only, as blackmail for looking after the refugees.

we realise why merkal has offered visa's, the real fear is this makes Turkish passports worth a lot more than these some very very poor people earn in years.
how many days does someone need in Germany to disappear certainly not 30
have Germany demanded Turkish people wishing to visit Germany pay some sort of bond in case they have to be repatriated at some future date.
I would not like to guess what percentage do not return after 1 year and cannot be found.

[universal]

Turkey seems to be used often as the frightener. In reality as a Sunni Muslim country it will be years and years if ever that they are allowed to join. In my opinion it will never happen. The Visa's that are being granted are for 30days only, as blackmail for looking after the refugees.

Yes all 20 of them!!! How much each have they cost the E.U. ? Turkey not so daft after all.


Turkish Prime Minister Ahmet Davutoglu said on Saturday around 20 Syrians had been readmitted to Turkey under an EU migrant deal designed to help stem migration to Europe across the Aegean Sea.

Taken from Reuters 28.04.16

[delderek]

Yes all 20 of them!!! How much each have they cost the E.U. ? Turkey not so daft after all.


Turkish Prime Minister Ahmet Davutoglu said on Saturday around 20 Syrians had been readmitted to Turkey under an EU migrant deal designed to help stem migration to Europe across the Aegean Sea.

Taken from Reuters 28.04.16

Nobody said, the Turks are not clever. Did they not invent the "Magic Carpet":dontknow:

[doreen]

Yes all 20 of them!!! How much each have they cost the E.U. ? Turkey not so daft after all.


Turkish Prime Minister Ahmet Davutoglu said on Saturday around 20 Syrians had been readmitted to Turkey under an EU migrant deal designed to help stem migration to Europe across the Aegean Sea.

Taken from Reuters 28.04.16


Well, here (http://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/apr/04/first-moves-to-deport-refugees-from-greece-to-turkey-underway) is a report on 4th April detailing 131 plus 66 being sent back, so your figure of just 20 is way off. EDIT: and the returns have continued since

And a few days ago I saw a report on the BBC news where for the first day not a single refugee arrived on Lesbos - previously 5,000 a day were arriving, so the scheme is working.

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we realise why merkal has offered visa's, the real fear is this makes Turkish passports worth a lot more than these some very very poor people earn in years.
how many days does someone need in Germany to disappear certainly not 30
have Germany demanded Turkish people wishing to visit Germany pay some sort of bond in case they have to be repatriated at some future date.
I would not like to guess what percentage do not return after 1 year and cannot be found.

You do realise there are over 1.5 million Turks already in Germany - from the Gastarbeiter days

[information]

Well, here (http://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/apr/04/first-moves-to-deport-refugees-from-greece-to-turkey-underway) is a report on 4th April detailing 131 plus 66 being sent back, so your figure of just 20 is way off. EDIT: and the returns have continued since

And a few days ago I saw a report on the BBC news where for the first day not a single refugee arrived on Lesbos - previously 5,000 a day were arriving, so the scheme is working.

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You do realise there are over 1.5 million Turks already in Germany - from the Gastarbeiter days

plus about 500,000 in the UK and most are hard working, tax paying law abiding people.

[universal]

~~Well, here is a report on 4th April detailing 131 plus 66 being sent back, so your figure of just 20 is way off. EDIT: and the returns have continued since.~~

Assuming that your figures are correct and that the Turkish prime minister and Reuters and wrong that still works out to
€15,228,426.40 per head. So that's not so bad after all.

[doreen]

~~Well, here is a report on 4th April detailing 131 plus 66 being sent back, so your figure of just 20 is way off. EDIT: and the returns have continued since.~~

Assuming that your figures are correct and that the Turkish prime minister and Reuters and wrong that still works out to
€15,228,426.40 per head. So that's not so bad after all.


Are you really being so obtuse or just pretending not to understand ... rather than reading just headlines, look deeper, read more. These 20 are the first formally accepted, many more have been returned in the meantime to be processed.

" ISTANBUL, April 30 (Reuters) - Turkish Prime Minister Ahmet Davutoglu said on Saturday around 20 Syrians had been readmitted to Turkey under an EU migrant deal designed to help stem migration to Europe across the Aegean Sea. According to the text of an address to the nation supplied in advance to the media, Davutoglu said that in return 110 Syrians had been sent to Europe for resettlement.
Turkey and the EU last month sealed a controversial deal intended to halt illegal migration to Europe in return for financial and political rewards for Ankara. Under the deal, Ankara gets more EU funding for refugees on its soil, revival of long-stalled EU accession talks and visa liberalisation for Turks travelling to Europe. In exchange, Turkey is due to prevent migrants and refugees from departing from its shores for Europe via irregular routes and take back all who reach the 28-nation bloc that way"

So for each refugee readmitted, others will be sent from the camps to Europe ... the sheer fact that the flow across the sea has slowed to practically zero shows that the deal is having a significant effect.

[bulldog]

plus about 500,000 in the UK and most are hard working, tax paying law abiding people.

and living in London :lol:, in one of my many past lives I was in the garment trade Turks were well known in the coat trade extremely hard
workers factories working 12 hours a day I always found them honest, kind people The U.K. needs to look at their home grown benefit
scroungers there the one,s who are dragging it down

[willowlily]

yes Doreen that I do, when visiting parts of Germany my Turkish comes in very handy. the Turkish tourists will have no problem finding a place to hide

[essexeddie]

If anyone thinks that the Turks will return home after a month are living in cloud cuckoo land. Their naivety is breath taking.



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