View Full Version : Community votes - cuota and number of votes
I live in small complex with 42 apartments. Our quote is the biggest with 7%, whereas the studios only have 2.2% (40 of these). Is it correctly understood that I only have 1 / 42 votes, or do I somehow get a higher voting rate due to that I own and pay more than three times what a studio do?
I live in small complex with 42 apartments. Our quote is the biggest with 7%, whereas the studios only have 2.2% (40 of these). Is it correctly understood that I only have 1 / 42 votes, or do I somehow get a higher voting rate due to that I own and pay more than three times what a studio do?
Although itīs one vote per property it is worked out on percentage (size of plot) so in effect you will have a larger vote than your studio owners.
Votes are counted in 2 ways, as a percentage of your coefficient and as an owner. For example you might own 20 apartments with a percentage vote of 40% and that might beat 10 owners with a total of 20% but there is also a count of the different owners which the owner of of 20 apartments only counts as one vote vs the other 10.
Votes need to be won bi laterally
Although itīs one vote per property it is worked out on percentage (size of plot) so in effect you will have a larger vote than your studio owners.
Thanks Suej,
Does this mean that will have a voting power of 7%, so if for example we have a meeting where three studios participate and me, then I would control the meeting as I have 0.4% more in total than them? Any link to where I can find some law stuff about these rules in Spain?
Gracias.
I did have a site that would have been very useful for you but it appears it no longer exists! Iīm sure you will get more help on here or try googling Community laws in Spain. You could take the easier option and ask your administrators.
bonitatime
17-08-2011, 11:46
http://www.c-euro.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=32&Itemid=37
This is probably a fairly accurate interpretation of the rules.
Thanks Suej,
Does this mean that will have a voting power of 7%, so if for example we have a meeting where three studios participate and me, then I would control the meeting as I have 0.4% more in total than them? Any link to where I can find some law stuff about these rules in Spain?
Gracias.
Read my post above yours in case you missed it
Votes are counted in 2 ways, as a percentage of your coefficient and as an owner. For example you might own 20 apartments with a percentage vote of 40% and that might beat 10 owners with a total of 20% but there is also a count of the different owners which the owner of of 20 apartments only counts as one vote vs the other 10.
Votes need to be won bi laterally
I believe I start to understand the system, but if my understanding is correct, then I also do not understand why it has been made that stupid. If we assume your example above with 50 apartments each 2% cuotas, and the 10 owners and I have are at the meeting. If I vote differently than the other 10, we cannot make any decision at the first convocation as we do not exceed 50% of the votes and 50% of the cuotas. At the second convocation we have the situation as you describe it, and here we cannot make a decision either as 10/11 votes say yes (90.9% of the votes) but only 20% / 60% (33.3% of the cuotas). So unable to make a decision.
If this is correct I must say the system is really stupid. Owners with large cuotas cannot use this for anything other than possibly obstruct decisions, but to whose benefit?
bonitatime
18-08-2011, 09:13
The first meeting can only take place at all if there are 50%
Could anyone clarify whether an apartment with two owners, ie. two persons are on the deed, have two votes (two hands) in the count of votes?
For example in a community of 10 apartments all attend the meeting. Two of the apartments have two owners, so 12 owners are present. Does this then mean that the two apartments with two owners could get the majority by voting together with three of the single owners, thus having 7/12 = 58% of the votes?
slodgedad
19-08-2011, 19:51
No. It doesn't matter how many owners a property has, it is the property that counts.
delderek
19-08-2011, 20:20
It does amaze me, as to how many people buy on a complex without knowing anything about community law, or at least reading a copy of the complex rules and statutes
No. It doesn't matter how many owners a property has, it is the property that counts.
Sure? If someone owns 2 properties, s/he has only 1 vote as far as I have understood. So here the property does not count.
slodgedad
19-08-2011, 20:27
Sure? If someone owns 2 properties, s/he has only 1 vote as far as I have understood. So here the property does not count.
I have always understood that the vote goes with the property, I'll stand correcting though.
delderek
19-08-2011, 20:37
If you have two properties you have two votes, it is one vote per property, but the co-efficient for certain votes is based on the size of the property, i,e a 70% majority vote may only be (for instance) 66% of the total co-efficient. Simple isn't it:whistle:
If you have two properties you have two votes, it is one vote per property, but the co-efficient for certain votes is based on the size of the property, i,e a 70% majority vote may only be (for instance) 66% of the total co-efficient. Simple isn't it:whistle:
It is quite confusing I must admit. Earlier today I read a post in another forum where it was said that the project company who still had a lot of unsold properties, only had 1 vote. Of course they have a large share of the quota, so I guess this way they could block for a decision.
I would like to hear from someone working professionally with this subject that you have one vote per property you own (which I currently doubt is correct), and that two owners who own a property together, has only got one vote.
slodgedad
19-08-2011, 20:53
It is quite confusing I must admit. Earlier today I read a post in another forum where it was said that the project company who still had a lot of unsold properties, only had 1 vote. Of course they have a large share of the quota, so I guess this way they could block for a decision.
I would like to hear from someone working professionally with this subject that you have one vote per property you own (which I currently doubt is correct), and that two owners who own a property together, has only got one vote.
It depends whether or no the community fees on all properties are paid, which usually is unlikely.
To have a community vote, fees must be up to date.
It depends whether or no the community fees on all properties are paid, which usually is unlikely.
To have a community vote, fees must be up to date.
Why do you bring this into the discussion ? It just creates confusion. I am aware of this fact (debtors cannot vote, but are allowed to participate in the meeting), but assumed all community fee's were paid.
slodgedad
19-08-2011, 21:47
Why do you bring this into the discussion ? It just creates confusion. I am aware of this fact (debtors cannot vote, but are allowed to participate in the meeting), but assumed all community fee's were paid.
The reason I brought this into the conversation is if a lot of properties on the complex, as on mine, remain unsold then those properties have no vote, or are not counted, unless the developer pay their community obligation.
This should, INHO, count against the percentage of votes needed
A property with multiple owners only have one vote, imagine if there was 100 owners of an apartment - by that logic that one apartment with 100 owners would sway every vote
A property with multiple owners only have one vote, imagine if there was 100 owners of an apartment - by that logic that one apartment with 100 owners would sway every vote
Thanks loaded, but as you have to have majority of both votes (hands) and quotas, that apartment would not be able to control everything. Probably also very unlikely and impractical that anyone should want to just put many names on the deed to get more votes on the AGM/EGM. And should you want to change this for tactical reasons, there would be a bill to pay in terms of igic, tax on gains, legal costs etc.
Via another owner (who was told so by his lawyer) I have heard that we and our neighbour have two votes each. We have the only two larger apartments with 7% and 5% of the quotas compared to the rests 2.2% each. As we do not get additional votes due to the size of our quotas (other than a kind of "veto" as the quotas also counts), I can not understand this in any other way. Have to mention also that our neighbour and we are the only apartments with two owners a.f.a.i.k., so we will meet with two persons for each apartment on the EGM. I find it illogical and unfair that we as being more than 3 times contributor in terms of monies paid, have only one votes as any other, so why shouldn't there be an illogical thing like two persons giving meeting also have a vote each, as also two owners of an apartment might have different points of view.
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